Dead People Talking

Why couldn't it have been mermen?
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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Okaros » 22 Sep 2014, 10:01:44

If the ritual fails due to the Virgins all being dead, what happens to the Facility if the game hasn't otherwise ended yet? Do they still leave?

And yeah, they're still in super-strong shape so this is more curiosity than anything else. :)
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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby necklessone » 22 Sep 2014, 11:07:00

That is a good question that I don't have an answer for. I think they have to; they have too much information to be allowed to ever have a stake in whether the humans or wolves win and if they don't have a stake in victory why should they stay in the game?

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Okaros » 22 Sep 2014, 11:31:05

necklessone wrote:That is a good question that I don't have an answer for. I think they have to; they have too much information to be allowed to ever have a stake in whether the humans or wolves win and if they don't have a stake in victory why should they stay in the game?


The should get devoured by demons or something. :twisted:
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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby necklessone » 22 Sep 2014, 11:42:43

I'm thinking more swallowed by a gaping chasm in the earth that opens where the cabin once sat.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby necklessone » 22 Sep 2014, 15:38:25

And Aldax has chosen...Admetus.

He chose poorly. :D

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Hellheart » 22 Sep 2014, 15:44:24

necklessone wrote:If the ritual fails (either through virgin slaughter or the humans/wolves winning before the fools are dealt with), then the ending narration will also include the beginning of the end of the world. The winners of either the humans or wolves will receive a Pyrrhic victory and the facility will be roundly mocked.

I'm not going to futz with the Facility anymore, so the remaining wolves are fine sacrifices. While I still think they'll achieve their goal, I think they were in better shape before locking up the virgins. Though if Meta4 is bandwagonned, then they just need to use their nightkill to win. They did luck out in the virgins being relatively unscathed this game so they didn't need to try stronger manipulations to keep them alive.

I would laugh SO HARD if the Facility tried to wrap up the game at the last moment with their Nightkill and Aldax protected their target.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Hellheart » 22 Sep 2014, 15:50:12

If meta4 and dferr both go down, I'm almost certain that Blindsniper will be policy-lynched for the game at some point.

Some REALLY good analysis by the humans at this point, even if some humans (especially Ryvvn) are lumped in with the wolves. Although that's colored a bit because the Facility really wants to lynch Ryvvn; in that regard, Meta4 as another Fool option will end up being an unexpected saving grace.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby necklessone » 22 Sep 2014, 15:55:10

Having those early wolf lynches as a data point always makes life harder for the wolves.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby necklessone » 22 Sep 2014, 16:25:10

Hellheart wrote:If meta4 and dferr both go down, I'm almost certain that Blindsniper will be policy-lynched for the game at some point.


I predict San will go immediately after the next two wolves.

---

There are currently 3 wolves, 2 facility, and 10 humans. If dferrantino or meta4 are lynched and the Facility mauls a human athlete, we go into Day 8 at 2 wolves, 8 humans. The wolves would then be three mislynches away, barring GA protections. Should be an interesting end game.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby necklessone » 22 Sep 2014, 18:02:35

Welcome to the new dead: meta4, Iron Clad Burrito, and Ryvvn.

And congratulations on a ritual successfully completed: Omega, Rictus, and 7z7!

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Omega » 22 Sep 2014, 18:05:28

Thanks, Necklessone.

Pop the Champagne everyone!

I SAW NOTHING! NOTHING!
Last edited by necklessone on 22 Sep 2014, 18:09:46, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Yes, I meant Zark.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Iron Clad Burrito » 22 Sep 2014, 18:16:23

Huh, I got it mostly wrong.

I was going to push for dferr tomorrow. I'd have been satisfied lynching San and/or blindsniper afterward. I don't know if I'd have pegged meta4, his vote for me was frankly too much of a Duh moment for me to have latched on to him.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Hellheart » 22 Sep 2014, 18:21:24

I love watching your play when you're confirmed human and can just go ham on everyone, ICB. I expected more of that over the last couple of days, but there was more than enough attacking from other players that you didn't really need to go that far. I know you would have totally done it if people were being too nice to each other though :lol:

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Hellheart » 22 Sep 2014, 18:26:50

The Facility taking out Ryvvn was a favor to the humans - either he's a wolf or he'd be mislynched (because spheno happened to be right about Rictus being facility and Ryvvn might look like he was just backing him up as one of the living wolves).

That said, there really wasn't a human-seeming player among the Fools for the Facility to target.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Omega » 22 Sep 2014, 18:34:57

Damn, should have taken out dferr. Sorry Ryvvn.

And does Fred's Dad even have a dentist?

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Hellheart » 22 Sep 2014, 18:40:14

Omega wrote:Damn, should have taken out dferr. Sorry Ryvvn.

And does Fred's Dad even have a dentist?

Necklessone wrote:But fire can't cleanse that much blood. Since that day, this site has drawn new werewolves every 50 years to repeat the massacre. You were actually up here last week committing foul rituals in the basement in preparation. Hell, Fred's Dad doesn't even have a dentist! This is all a setup and now these fools, your "friends", will pay.

You'd think somebody would've mentioned that Fred's dad has no teeth and he's, like, maybe 35. If he really does have a dentist, I wouldn't want to be near anything that guy's touched.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Omega » 22 Sep 2014, 19:03:25

I did miss that...

Read through everything, fun game Neckless, the Facility thing could have easily gone differently depending on a few RNGs.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Rictus » 22 Sep 2014, 19:09:47

1. What an impressive amount of bullshit to spew sphenodont. And scary how close to the truth you were. ;)

2. My wolf hunting record wasn't so good this game. Sorry we killed you Ryvvn. You were right and I was wrong.

3. Had a great game necklessone, thanks for running it.
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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Ryvvn » 22 Sep 2014, 23:34:46

Thanks for this clearly totally vanilla game, Necklessone; I mean just cause you outright say it's not totally vanilla, doesn't mean it's not totally vanilla, amiright?! I am really glad you cleared up the win conditions when you did, otherwise I may have hard-sat on Rictus.

I agree wholeheartedly with PJ's reasoning for why Rictus should have been lynched (prior to GM clarification) despite it having been wolf decreed.

I appreciate all the compliments coming from Rictus and Omega when deciding on killing me or dferr.

I hate that it takes me til mid-to-late game to really start picking out wolves, which means I'm either going to get lucky early or just look awful like I did this game. Glad I at least nailed dferr as a wolf, though I doubt anyone will look twice at it... not after they followed me onto poor Anzig day 2.

Anzig, really sorry about that. :oops:

Hellheart, I apologize for yet another inaccurate read on my part toward you, but I stand by my comments regarding the situation. If someone severely draws my attention away from what I'm currently trying to deduce, I'm going to vote for the one acting (what I feel is) strangely.

Overall I really enjoyed this game, I probably should have given the movie a fresh viewing once it became clear the theme was more than just aesthetic. I'd like to see something like this run again, maybe using the theory someone said during this game, which was what if there were multiple factions of monsters but the humans end up choosing which ones they're fighting (which group becomes the wolves). Not sure how exactly the start of the would work, but it just sounds like a neat idea!

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby sphenodont » 23 Sep 2014, 05:05:43

Ryvvn wrote:Overall I really enjoyed this game, I probably should have given the movie a fresh viewing once it became clear the theme was more than just aesthetic. I'd like to see something like this run again, maybe using the theory someone said during this game, which was what if there were multiple factions of monsters but the humans end up choosing which ones they're fighting (which group becomes the wolves). Not sure how exactly the start of the would work, but it just sounds like a neat idea!


Yeah, I was thinking about that, too. Maybe you could take inspiration from the House on Haunted Hill board game, where you set certain triggers and that randomly flips certain players into psychopaths. I think that could probably be developed a bit, but you'd need more of a foregame where people aren't necessarily dying (which would lead to a longer game).

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby sphenodont » 23 Sep 2014, 05:06:56

Rictus wrote:1. What an impressive amount of bullshit to spew sphenodont. And scary how close to the truth you were. ;)


Thank you!

I just wish I could be as inspired when I'm a human and trying to figure out the wolves. And also convince people that I'm really a human this time guys, really. :)

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Snake » 23 Sep 2014, 05:18:55

San votes for the GA. It's a bold strategy, Cotton.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby DastardlyOldMan » 23 Sep 2014, 06:34:33

Just one minor nit - the narrative makes it ~seem like the facility left the game, and *then* there were two nightkills. If I were a human, I'd be just a bit paranoid about the fourth faction that made that second kill. Granted, that's open for interpretation - the bodies were discovered after the facility exited stage boathouse (and that may have been your intent), but that might be something you want to clarify.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Hellheart » 23 Sep 2014, 09:23:27

sphenodont wrote:
Rictus wrote:1. What an impressive amount of bullshit to spew sphenodont. And scary how close to the truth you were. ;)


Thank you!

I just wish I could be as inspired when I'm a human and trying to figure out the wolves. And also convince people that I'm really a human this time guys, really. :)

That's a crock of shit. You managed to be a wolf even when the RNG didn't play a part.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby That PJ » 23 Sep 2014, 09:28:31

I'm enjoying the structure of this game as I'm able to sit here and reflect on it. Well done, necklessone. It's just twisted from vanilla enough to be interesting without being totally crazy, and I really like that. The third faction in particular.

I'd like to see more games where the wolves are selected non-randomly. That's an interesting notion.
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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Omega » 23 Sep 2014, 11:07:56

dferrantino wrote:And uh, I guess look kind of suspicious now too.


Am I the only one who finds this suspicious? Just rings so hollow to me.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Okaros » 23 Sep 2014, 11:17:31

Omega wrote:
dferrantino wrote:And uh, I guess look kind of suspicious now too.


Am I the only one who finds this suspicious? Just rings so hollow to me.


That sounds somewhat hollow to me. The "I don't understand yesterday's votes for jokerfish..." line is what *really* rings hollow for me, tbh. That's a giant of bundle of doubt-casting smoothed over into a single statement. It's simultaneously trying to cast doubt on the people lynching jokerfish yesterday, cast doubt on Ionitor today, AND cast doubt on the likelihood of joker flipping wolf... while in the same post he votes for jokerfish. Wow! Such doublespeak, very wolf. :flail:
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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Rictus » 23 Sep 2014, 16:46:10

It seems like the humans are aimless right now.
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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby That PJ » 23 Sep 2014, 16:51:16

Rictus wrote:It seems like the humans are aimless right now.

Just wait until you see them without Admetus.
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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby necklessone » 23 Sep 2014, 18:16:32

Welcome to jokerfish and Admetus. Sorry I didn't give you a fancier death; something in my brain just snapped in the last 20 minutes.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby necklessone » 23 Sep 2014, 18:33:40

So, will Aldax reveal today? He protected Ionitor last night, so he can reveal and self protect and guarantee he's around for two more days.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Omega » 23 Sep 2014, 18:46:17

No reason not to.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Admetus » 23 Sep 2014, 18:56:29

necklessone wrote:4) Having my player list sorted by role when I posted a vote tally. The list of player who hadn't voted is based on my sort, so all the specials were first in that list. Quietly fixed within a few minutes.

I could have sworn I saw a vote tally out of order at one point, but I'm not sure that's true. At the time I just thought it was odd, didn't even think that it might mean something. (Also not sure I remembered correctly.)
necklessone wrote:I wanted to leave a little wiggle room to whether or not it was actually based on Cabin in the Woods, which sadly meant no basement scene. There have been some really good ideas as people have tried to guess what the game actually was; I really liked the idea of the day 1 lynch acting as the basement scene somehow.

My real regret is I couldn't find a good way to adapt the third act to the game. Going completely off the rails in the endgame didn't seem fair to the players. At least this means it's relatively unspoiled for anyone who wants to go watch the movie (which is a plan of action I fully endorse).

I thought the way you wouldn't completely claim the movie was the basis of the game was a fun tension. I could speculate, and I was right at one point, but I couldn't go too far off the rails for fear of messing up if the game was in fact mostly vanilla.

Also, I think we need to have a game that uses some variant of the lynch as villain selection. But it has to be something slightly more meaningful than just delaying random.org's wolf assignment. As I'd proposed it, the only relevant game effect would have been that Day 1's vote record surprisingly wouldn't actually mean anything.

-edit-
Hah, it's amusing that so many people remembered the concept but not the origin. I officially don't put any "dibs" on it, so use it if you like. Just warn me ahead of time so I can watch it happen! :D Maybe I'd try to work out how to make it viable at some point, but it only seems like a partial idea at this point.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Admetus » 23 Sep 2014, 19:11:09

DastardlyOldMan wrote:Just one minor nit - the narrative makes it ~seem like the facility left the game, and *then* there were two nightkills. If I were a human, I'd be just a bit paranoid about the fourth faction that made that second kill. Granted, that's open for interpretation - the bodies were discovered after the facility exited stage boathouse (and that may have been your intent), but that might be something you want to clarify.

Rather proud of working that out on my own. I think enough hints were there.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby necklessone » 23 Sep 2014, 19:16:17

Admetus wrote:Also, I think we need to have a game that uses some variant of the lynch as villain selection. But it has to be something slightly more meaningful than just delaying random.org's wolf assignment. As I'd proposed it, the only relevant game effect would have been that Day 1's vote record surprisingly wouldn't actually mean anything.

-edit-
Hah, it's amusing that so many people remembered the concept but not the origin. I officially don't put any "dibs" on it, so use it if you like. Just warn me ahead of time so I can watch it happen! :D Maybe I'd try to work out how to make it viable at some point, but it only seems like a partial idea at this point.

I actually figured out at least one way to make this work while letting my mind wander in the lab today. I actually need to add it to my big list of TWG ideas.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Admetus » 23 Sep 2014, 19:41:18

Oh! I forgot to mention.

Good job to the wolves on poisoning the analysis. I defended Blindsniper based on that, and left a note that Ionitor looked more wolfy with Human Jokerfish, so it certainly worked out.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Okaros » 24 Sep 2014, 07:32:30

Speaking of analysis, I wanted to ask...
:
Day 3 ThatPJ wrote:Especially given the rather thin basis for it. He pushed someone up to two votes, making a sixth tie. Comparatively speaking, this is rather petty next to the arguments for Ionitor, sphenodont, Hellheart, or even Rictus (which is not a very good argument, either, in my opinion). It seems awfully forced and sudden and driven almost entirely by the gut instinct of a couple of people.

...But having said that, I'm sure he'll wind up flipping wolf and make me wonder why I bother to analyze at all.


So PJ, still going to bother analyzing in the future? :eyebrow:
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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby rekard » 24 Sep 2014, 08:02:38

No. He'll just ask me and be done with it.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Okaros » 24 Sep 2014, 08:41:33

rekard wrote:No. He'll just ask me and be done with it.


Yeah, but you'll just say "Wolf" 100% of the time. :P
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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby That PJ » 24 Sep 2014, 09:29:32

Okaros wrote:
rekard wrote:No. He'll just ask me and be done with it.


Yeah, but you'll just say "Wolf" 100% of the time. :P

And 50% of the time, he'll be right. Apparently.

I'd trust anybody else's analysis over rekard's, for good or ill; we just don't think alike, I'm afraid. But it has made me try to figure out how you skated by my radar while, on the other hand, I picked up sphenodont and meta4 on my own. Just something I'll get the hang of, or I'll identify it as a blind spot.

I also didn't pick up dferrantino, but I'd like to think Ryvvn's breakdown would've been something I'd latch onto. It was extraordinarily thorough and well-reasoned. I'm so sad everyone overlooked it.
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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Snake » 24 Sep 2014, 09:52:09

I think Ionitor needs to bring a strong vote to the table here. I'm not a big fan of defending yourself. It seems to always be more effective to try and shift attention with a good case before multiple people look at you.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Admetus » 24 Sep 2014, 09:57:42

That PJ wrote:I also didn't pick up dferrantino, but I'd like to think Ryvvn's breakdown would've been something I'd latch onto. It was extraordinarily thorough and well-reasoned. I'm so sad everyone overlooked it.

I didn't ignore that. Dferrantino was one of my top suspects, mainly because he kept coming up in known humans' lists. I just made the mistake of attacking Jokerfish and defending Blindsniper first, which will probably be the more memorable things if people go back to re-read prior days.

I'd like to think if I was still alive today, I'd be voting for dferrantino. One can never quite be sure, but the main question is whether I'd have continued to give Ionitor the benefit of the doubt, and I think I could have.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby necklessone » 24 Sep 2014, 11:25:41

If I set up the game again, Okaros would have been a human. I feel like the humans could really have used one more day of leeway.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Admetus » 24 Sep 2014, 11:43:01

Yeah, since the Facility folk were likely to leave one way or another before end of game, 6/23 is a bit high for wolves. But there were all the usual human specials as well....

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Meta4 » 24 Sep 2014, 12:18:12

Hellheart wrote:
7-zark-7 wrote:
Hellheart wrote:This is how I play. I am not going to change how I play because people want me to be quieter or nicer or less emotional. I either play this way, or I don't really play at all. It's binary, and that's all there is to it. Stop killing me for it.


I get this. I get lynched / mauled for a number of reasons. One is I can be a distraction, the other is (correct me if I'm wrong) I'm said to be hard to read. In either case, I play by a different schema: narrative flow. In any case, if I am lynched or mauled, it is by someone playing a game. I can always repay the favor later if it chafes too much for any reason.

The thing that really bothers me is that I don't even remember the last time I died to humans for vote-based reasons in a human-wolf based game. Like I understand people lynching me because they see something in a post or the way I'm acting, but every single time they're wrong. It's not a viable way to catch me as a wolf, but it's certainly a viable way to kill me off as a human.

LXXIV: Behavior-based lynch (with Meta4 vote)
LXXII: Behavior-based lynch (with Meta4 vote)
LXVII: Behavior-based Vig after avoiding a Behavior-based lynch (because Zark blocked the GA)
LXVI: ?-based Vig (nicotine-deprived DOM) (with meta4 vote)
LXIV: I LIVE! (with meta4 vote)

I wasn't kidding about the Meta4 votes. I'm pretty sure there's other times in those games that he's the 2nd vote on me.


Sorry, I missed the original discussion. I'm not entirely certain what is going on here, but it appears you think I'm voting for you maliciously for out-of-game reasons. I assure you that isn't the case and I don't hold any grudges against you or anyone else. The only person I've ever voted for repeatedly across games is RaveBomb, and that's my day one schtick. For what it's worth, I don't think five votes out across eleven games (64 to 74) is particularly remarkable, but I don't want to trivialize your position.

Anyway, I apologize for upsetting you. I'm here to have fun, and I certainly don't want to ruin anyone else's enjoyment, intentionally or otherwise. If I've managed to completely misunderstand the discussion, please let me know.
"...it continues to be a bad idea to give in to the urge to lynch Meta4." -Admetus

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Omega » 24 Sep 2014, 12:18:59

If I'd had a bit more time, I probably could has sussed out that dferrantino was the wolf, not Ryvvn, but, once I realized that we were out either way, I hung up my analysis hat. :facepalm:

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Admetus » 24 Sep 2014, 13:28:36

Just finished reading the Facility forum. I figured the hedges against lynch redirection were low cost since I was a known human, but I thought the chances of a power like that being in the game were slim to none. Turns out it was a thing after all!
Desperation - These powers will remain the same each day and are once per game. If you are desperate, you may:
Lynch the person who gets the second most votes.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Okaros » 24 Sep 2014, 14:42:25

That repeat vote on Aldax by San has the potential to cost the humans the game. :flail:

If they lynch Ionitor today and Aldax reveals as the GA tomorrow, San's voting record is going to look horrific and the "You tried to lynch the GA for multiple days" argument is going to carry an awful lot of weight...
I kind of assume Okaros is out to backstab me until proven otherwise. - DOM

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby necklessone » 24 Sep 2014, 14:44:54

It's such a bad argument, though. It sounds nice, but it implies a wolf was somehow able to know who the GA was.

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Re: Dead People Talking

Postby Okaros » 24 Sep 2014, 14:57:55

necklessone wrote:It's such a bad argument, though. It sounds nice, but it implies a wolf was somehow able to know who the GA was.



That argument would come from Aldax, so I'm not sure if/how he'd use it. It's more an emotional reaction thing though, not really a logical argument. I know *I* would certainly have to pause for a moment to think through it rationally if Aldax revealed and made a pitch for San's death regardless of whether he actually used the "he was trying to lynch the GA" argument for support.
I kind of assume Okaros is out to backstab me until proven otherwise. - DOM


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