Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Gungnir888 » 20 Sep 2016, 13:24:46

It would be less fun if the seering is chosen at random, and the wolf is exposed through luck rather than deduction. Throwing a confirmed human into the mix would be a decent boon at this point.

I haven't seen the mechanic used, but I only predate you by a couple games.

From a purely chaotic standpoint, it would be fantastic to throw a town fool into the mix this late into the game. This is wildly unfair and against the spirit of the humans getting something helpful, but much enjoyment will be had by those on the sidelines. Oxen can be ornery, and nothing sets the stage like a hoof to the head.

I'm also on board with turning jrs into a sasquatch. Maybe call it a strongman like ability where he takes a day to die after getting mauled.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Ryvvn » 20 Sep 2016, 13:29:21

Since I mentioned it to FCM in person, I'll share my thoughts here:

I think the reward should be the town now gets to elect a Sheriff whose vote counts for double and who holds a one time vig shot. This seems in line with the wolves abilities throughout the voyage, where they were a risk/reward, so is this in that the village may accidentally elect the wolf as a sheriff/vig. This also avoids any potentially confirmed humans by awaking one as a new special.

What I mean by that is, especially since FCM now publicly confirmed one remaining wolf, if she were to announce that the reward is one human has been awoken as X special, then that human can immediately claim without fear of a counterclaim, so not only do the humans essentially get a free seering but also whatever other added benefit of the new special role (hunter or otherwise) without any risk to them at all.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Gungnir888 » 20 Sep 2016, 13:33:12

That's a pretty decent idea, and I had not read the main thread that announced there was a single wolf prior to posting.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Admetus » 20 Sep 2016, 13:34:10

Ryvvn's got some good points there. I do think that whatever it is, should include a public vote for who gets it, or whether to use it, or who to use it on.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Ryvvn » 20 Sep 2016, 13:37:44

Jehos wrote:Oof, saying there's one wolf left is not helpful!

It is unfortunate that the question was finally asked today, but I think FCM did the correct thing by answering since she would have answered it at any point had it been asked earlier.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby 7-zark-7 » 20 Sep 2016, 13:47:07

Gungnir888 wrote:much enjoyment will be had by those on the sidelines. Oxen can be ornery, and nothing sets the stage like a hoof to the head.


Hung it speaks wisely, and in 888 part harmony. It's worth considering that the dead will always outnumber the living (if not specifically now, certainly soon). Our entertainment needs must be paramount.

More in a bit,

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Edit: Hung it is how autocorrect spells Gungnir... Damn it, I like it - lead on Hung it!
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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby 7-zark-7 » 20 Sep 2016, 13:50:55

I like the sherif idea. Is this a one time thing, or can the position be passed to a successor?

More in a bit,

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Omega » 20 Sep 2016, 14:12:57

I really like this public vig play.

I'm not sure if it's a good idea. But it's wildly entertaining!

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Visigoth » 20 Sep 2016, 14:21:21

Thanks for the game FCM. Though if the game EOD was earlier I likely could have saved myself. :shake: ;)

I highly expect this game to come down to the final 4 or 3 since I imagine Jehos is going to be totally under the radar. Between the missed vote which involved a wolf and then being one of the people on Ryvvn and with the now announced wolf count I imagine people on Ryvvn might get a little bit of a pass. Well at least you'd think that but instead people seem to be focusing on everyone that voted on Ryvvn except Jehos.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Ryvvn » 20 Sep 2016, 15:31:20

7-zark-7 wrote:I like the sherif idea. Is this a one time thing, or can the position be passed to a successor?

More in a bit,

7z7

If it were me running it, I'd make it a permanent passable position by daily vote; though the sheriff vig is one time, used by whichever acting sheriff decides it's time to fire.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Gungnir888 » 20 Sep 2016, 16:25:41

I think I'll pocket being awol on the day thread while placing a maul if I'm ever a solo wolf.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Omega » 20 Sep 2016, 16:32:31

Gungnir888 wrote:I think I'll pocket being awol on the day thread while placing a maul if I'm ever a solo wolf.


No vote, no maul. That would be a ridiculous loop hole! haha

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Gungnir888 » 20 Sep 2016, 16:39:21

Fair enough, it's a pretty brutal ploy.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby rekard » 20 Sep 2016, 17:09:25

Oh my god. This is tiring. I talk I'm a wolf. I don't talk I'm a wolf. I'm aggressive I'm a wolf. I'm passive I'm a wolf. I do small analysis, I'm a wolf. I try to do deep analysis, I'm a wolf.

For one game it seemed like talking like Deadpool helped put those bias a bit away. But it's exhausting to maintain that and some don't like it. Once I drop it, bam. Again I'm a wolf. The next game I'm gonna just do one word votes starting on day 3. No analysis, no nothing else.

And Rictus. No animosity? You have been putting me on a leading lynch wagon for freaking four games in a row now. You are a clear common denominator there. I could understand somewhat if I had won as a wolf recently. But I've haven't been one for 18 games. And now you vig me. At least freaking admit you're prejudiced against me. It feels just too damn personal.

Let's see how it feels when someone targets you for lynches, vig shots and mauls for the next 5-10 games.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby rekard » 20 Sep 2016, 17:26:29

And Catmother. Good game. The low wolf count seems to be offset by the risk reward maul abilities which were powerful themselves. The seer maul power could be op but the wolf count is low so that compensates it nicely.

I like the balance. First game in a while that seems like humans having a chance of winning.

The prize should be as advertised. Beneficial to the humans. No wolf sheriff. It was the wolves' job to impede them from getting there. The seer maul power would have made things a bit easier if it had been in play but it's tough to balance.

I think the original idea of a public seering where everyone votes for who to seer seems good and innovative. It's difficult to predict how people will react to such a power. Obviously, the elected one can't be mauled the day he gets seered.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Ryvvn » 20 Sep 2016, 17:38:06

Omega wrote:
Gungnir888 wrote:I think I'll pocket being awol on the day thread while placing a maul if I'm ever a solo wolf.


No vote, no maul. That would be a ridiculous loop hole! haha

Also a pretty easy way to confirm your own humanity, I'd rather have the loop hole; actually I'd rather have full participation :/

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Ryvvn » 20 Sep 2016, 17:40:16

Actually, since FCM never said "no vote, no maul" hopefully the others won't assume that's a confirmation of spheno's humanity. Otherwise, if that is the generally understood rule then there should be no grace period for missed votes when down to lone wolf and spheno should have been immediately WoG'd.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby The Fairy Catmother » 20 Sep 2016, 19:42:56

Ryvvn wrote:Actually, since FCM never said "no vote, no maul" hopefully the others won't assume that's a confirmation of spheno's humanity. Otherwise, if that is the generally understood rule then there should be no grace period for missed votes when down to lone wolf and spheno should have been immediately WoG'd.


This is a really good point...When I announced that there was only one wolf left, I didn't foresee that sphenodont being human was the next logical conclusion players would reach.
Even though I didn't explicitly say "no vote, no maul" in the rules, obviously they are correct in this assumption.
I REALLY don't like there being another confirmed human in the mix, especially with the vigilante's reveal and the humans reaching Willamette Valley tonight.
I wish I had WoG'd him last night, but I was trying to keep the 3 strikes guideline that I've seen other GMs use.
At this point, I'm really hoping that sphenodont misses again today so I can WoG him and be done with it.
But if he doesn't miss today, I don't know what to do with him.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby rekard » 20 Sep 2016, 19:50:06

Don't worry much about it. There have been times where wolves cast a maul vote but forget to do a lynch vote. Missing votes isn't a 100% guarantee that someone is a human.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby The Fairy Catmother » 20 Sep 2016, 21:27:56

From our dear friend Mister E. Meat:

Funny how things change in the course of a day. This morning, I thought for sure I was a dead man. I couldn't get through to rekard at all. Now, with a few hours to go, it's a tossup between Rave and Aldax but if Rave does show up prior to EOD it means that Aldax is probably going to die. No idea if that's the better choice or not. I'm dumping this here because I want to give the dead something to laugh about mostly and also because any credibility I thought I would have had for chasing Ryvvn was thoroughly destroyed by rekard.

I have no idea who the last wolf is. Rave is mostly a gut feeling that he might be based on some of the interactions he had with Ryvvn + the "you're not my son" stuff. Could be shooting totally in the dark.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Admetus » 20 Sep 2016, 22:27:52

It's really hard to read it without the benefit of dead vision, but I thought Jehos's post where he switched off of MEM was pretty human looking. On the down side, it is more high visibility, and might cause him to lose his out-of-sight-out-of-mind status with some of the remaining humans.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby RaveBomb » 21 Sep 2016, 07:55:36

Thanks for the game!

I'm sorry that my attention wasn't as in as I wanted it to be. My life got BUSY these last couple of weeks. :(
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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Ryvvn » 21 Sep 2016, 13:53:10

Sad no one is biting on the sheriff bit, maybe voting should have been mandatory, ah well.

I think the game is just too close to concluding here that, unless the humans had received a 100% clear and useful benefit, they probably don't want to bother; didn't think about that when suggesting the idea.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby sphenodont » 21 Sep 2016, 14:14:33

Sorry for being absent and failing to vote. I thought I'd be able to participate at least a bit during my vacation, but the place we were staying at ended up having no cell reception, no wifi, and was an hour away from a store where we could leech wifi from the parking lot.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby The Fairy Catmother » 21 Sep 2016, 18:25:19

Damn. I should've gone for the public seering. Or maybe no one is sure enough about anybody else to suggest a sheriff.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Rictus » 21 Sep 2016, 19:25:28

Thanks for the game Fairy Cat Mother - I thoroughly enjoyed it! I thought the theme was excellent, and I had a heck of a good time as Dysentery. Very glad that nobody tried to lynch me based on my avatar.

Jehos is in a good spot. Of the possible four wolves I was considering (Anzig, Aldax, Jehos, and Ravebomb), he is certainly the least suspicious. But I don't know why MEM is calling him human. I think Jehos really got lucky by not voting on Day 1. That was a HUGE lucky break.

As for my vig shot, I think it fit the theme perfectly. I'm sure rekard disagrees.
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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby twdog » 21 Sep 2016, 22:49:57

Hey, a bunch of stuff came up and I basically dropped off the face of the earth, but I did want to pop in and say that I enjoyed the game, and thank you for running it.
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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Mister E. Meat » 22 Sep 2016, 04:28:51

Visigoth wrote:Thanks for the game FCM. Though if the game EOD was earlier I likely could have saved myself. :shake: ;)

I highly expect this game to come down to the final 4 or 3 since I imagine Jehos is going to be totally under the radar. Between the missed vote which involved a wolf and then being one of the people on Ryvvn and with the now announced wolf count I imagine people on Ryvvn might get a little bit of a pass. Well at least you'd think that but instead people seem to be focusing on everyone that voted on Ryvvn except Jehos.

100% this. Missing day 1 was very beneficial for Jehos given the train wreck it was for the wolves. Putting a vote on Ryvvn to lone wolf it so early was a bold move that I didn't see coming.
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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Mister E. Meat » 22 Sep 2016, 04:32:33

The Fairy Catmother wrote:Damn. I should've gone for the public seering. Or maybe no one is sure enough about anybody else to suggest a sheriff.

Yeah, this was my concern. Why risk giving a lone wolf more power? Also, why risk sticking your neck out and drawing more attention? I think you should have made it mandatory to vote for a sheriff which would have sort of alleviated both concerns.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Omega » 22 Sep 2016, 05:30:52

While in truth it was probably less "design" and more forgetfulness or something, I think "NO SHERIFF" is a totally reasonable vote. Especially at this point in the game, handing a loaded gun to someone could be the end.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Omega » 22 Sep 2016, 06:50:49

Jehos taking an active lead at the end here may just win this game for him.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Gungnir888 » 22 Sep 2016, 07:50:55

Excellent play, though vote history aside, jrs has appeared exceptionally human this game. I know I wouldn't catch it, but I wonder if anyone will comment on how vocal Jehos has become since it was announced there was a single wolf left.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Omega » 22 Sep 2016, 08:02:15

Gungnir888 wrote:Excellent play, though vote history aside, jrs has appeared exceptionally human this game. I know I wouldn't catch it, but I wonder if anyone will comment on how vocal Jehos has become since it was announced there was a single wolf left.


Someone had to start talking. That doesn't seem too crazy to me. But certainly could be an otherwise innocuous nugget of information that points people to the correct target! Stranger Things have happened.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby rekard » 22 Sep 2016, 09:11:41

That missed day 1 vote has helped Jehos a lot. Things would likely be different if he had voted around those wagons.

Also I would say assign a deadline for the sheriff vote and shot The sooner that resolves, the less time people will want to discuss.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Gungnir888 » 22 Sep 2016, 09:50:26

Might penalize the people that haven't checked in today. The day could always be split into two, that way the game resolves tomorrow without heading into a long and slow weekend.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Okaros » 22 Sep 2016, 09:55:43

Omega wrote:While in truth it was probably less "design" and more forgetfulness or something, I think "NO SHERIFF" is a totally reasonable vote. Especially at this point in the game, handing a loaded gun to someone could be the end.


I'd actually be insisting on "No Sheriff" at this point. You don't need the vig shot to win on the human side, and the threat of the wolf getting the shot plus bonus vote is awful (the wolf could publicly out themselves at that point and still have a 50/50 shot at winning).

It'd be a much different story had they elected a sheriff yesterday as they could've vig'd Aldax and prevented the wasted day of voting.
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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Admetus » 22 Sep 2016, 10:27:07

rekard wrote:Also I would say assign a deadline for the sheriff vote and shot The sooner that resolves, the less time people will want to discuss.

Asbath has 2/4 votes so far. One more vote and he's sheriff, and I'd have to assume he'll vote for himself.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Rictus » 22 Sep 2016, 12:04:16

And now Anzig points out the flaw. The sheriff will be a confirmed human, and his vote counts for 2 so in effect, the game is over.

Asbath has two chances to win, and nobody else can influence it except through Asbath.
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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Ryvvn » 22 Sep 2016, 12:52:54

Rictus wrote:And now Anzig points out the flaw. The sheriff will be a confirmed human, and his vote counts for 2 so in effect, the game is over.

Am I missing something, what flaw? The game doesn't auto-end at voting parity, so the sheriff is not a confirmed human. A wolf sheriff would shoot a human and reach voting parity with the remaining two, but it still is not in their best interest to out themselves and leave it to a coin flip, they would want to still go for the solid win and get at least one of the others to side with them, and so the game continues as normal.

Actually, given the state of the game and the potentially late time of day a shot may be taken, were I running this, I'd actually reset the votes after the sheriff's shot (flavoring with the town in shock that wasn't the last wolf), and then restart final 3 from there with no EoD time and vote locking allowed.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Admetus » 22 Sep 2016, 13:19:15

People seem to be thinking that voting parity is what ends the game, but it's simple enough to say that people parity is what counts. Or simple enough to say parity is only checked at the beginning of the day.

Asbath isn't mechanically confirmed human at all.

If they miss, and lynch a human, it'd be sheriff vs wolf, and the sheriff would always win the "vote." But if that was going to end in a human win, someone should have said something about it right up front. No, if they miss this shot and lynch, the wolf eats the sheriff.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Okaros » 22 Sep 2016, 13:24:22

Admetus wrote:Asbath isn't mechanically confirmed human at all.

No, but the players have basically agreed to bet everything on him being human so it's functionally the same. Nobody's going to vote someone sheriff and then immediately turn around and lynch them unless the sheriff is an idiot and admits to being the wolf. :)
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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Rictus » 22 Sep 2016, 13:28:23

Look I didn’t see it either until Anzig asked about it.

1) Asbath gets a vig shot. It’s his game to win or lose.
2) After the shot, he still has an unbreakable coalition of 2 votes. The ONLY way it goes to a coin flip is if both of the two remaining players decide Asbath is a wolf. Keep in mind one of them thought Asbath was so human that he gave him a gun and badge. Otherwise, Asbath’s two votes determines the lynch and the other two votes are just default votes against each other.


For everyone except Asbath, the endgame decision was “Who’s the most likely human” vs “Who’s the most likely wolf”, and they've already made that decision. The rest of today will just be mind games trying to influence Asbath.
Charming, to the last.
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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby The Fairy Catmother » 22 Sep 2016, 14:16:16

Okaros wrote: It'd be a much different story had they elected a sheriff yesterday as they could've vig'd Aldax and prevented the wasted day of voting.


That's precisely what I was expecting them to do. Also, yesterday the sheriff would've only needed 66% of the vote instead of the 75% needed today.
If I were playing in this game, I would've been rallying to get the sheriff elected and shoot Aldax yesterday.

But it does make things more interesting that this is all happening at LoL. :P

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Mister E. Meat » 22 Sep 2016, 14:48:49

It's interesting because you've essentially given asbath no downside to shooting since it doesn't change the lynch or lose condition. It's no different than the humans voting "no lynch" and not allowing the wolf to vote "no maul." This actually works in the humans favor I think.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby rekard » 22 Sep 2016, 16:15:26

Well. The intention was to be a prize for the humans in the first place right?

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby The Fairy Catmother » 22 Sep 2016, 16:27:36

I do hope that has bath realizes that the sooner he shoots, the better. If he ends up shooting at the last minute and not allowing the remaining human enough time to possibly change their lynch vote, that would be a frustrating end for the humans.
(I'm not extending the day...I liked that this game was going to end tonight.last thing I want is for it to go into another long weekend)

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby 7-zark-7 » 22 Sep 2016, 16:49:18

Rictus wrote:I had a heck of a good time as Dysentery. Very glad that nobody tried to lynch me based on my avatar.
<<SNIP>>
As for my vig shot, I think it fit the theme perfectly. I'm sure rekard disagrees.


I would never lynch anyone based solely upon their RP or avatar (unless it was in character for me to do so, of course).

But the fact that a player was ~gunned down by dysentery on the Oregon Trail~... well, that's just why we play the game.

Being the player who is gunned down by infectious disease was never going to be easy. Rekard will vig/maul you and then you'll be besties all over again.

More in a bit,

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"The possibility that it's Zark simply murdering someone at a whim each day... would be delightful if true, but I worry that that's too simple a solution." - Okaros

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Omega » 22 Sep 2016, 20:02:02

This is going to be one for the books. A truly epic ending.

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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Rictus » 22 Sep 2016, 20:07:31

I can't believe the humans are going to lose it. Wow.
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Re: Ye Ole Saloon (witty banter and snarky comments)

Postby Omega » 22 Sep 2016, 20:18:23

:shock:


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